I strongly support the existence of good church shepherds, good church pastors, good elders, who visit their flock, provide help to them, do keep vigilance, guard over them and their good welfare, visit them in the Hospital too. These acts clearly distinguishes them from the much too many bad pastors, rather pastoral prostitutes or hirelings WE SEEM TO STILL ENOUNTER EVEN THESE DAYS. * Bad men who were not chosen by God to be shepherds, but rather self appointed even for many wrong reasons. And the term pastors in the Bible is rather a plural one meaning the local church should have many of them now too. Not just a false one man dictatorial ministry.
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2012/03/13/about-those-hirelings-now-fleecing-the-sheep/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2012/03/05/spirtual-abuse-by-the-so-called-christian-leaders/
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EACH PERSON CAN BE A DR JEKYLL OR A MR HYDE CONCURRENTLY, A GOOD PERSON AT ONE TIME AND OTHER BAD PERSON NEXT TOO IT DEPENDS UPON WHAT PART OF YOU YOU NOW DO ALLOW TO DOMINATE, INFLUENCE, CONTROL YOU. WE CAN WALK IN THE FLESH OR IN THE HOLY SPIRIT. We can walk humbly or walk in a false pride… AND THE RESULTS WILL VARY TOO.
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By the way while I consider the Pentecostal churches to be far superior over any other groups, denominations still there are good and bad Pentecostals, good and bad Pentecostal pastors, churches. Just like there are good and bad Professing Christians http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/the-false-jesus-name-apostolic-holiness-church-oneness-pentecostal-christianity/
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It is a very sad reality that even these days in the churches that up to 70 percent of the pastors have not been called by God, they are imposters, hirelings and are not genuine shepherds of the flock. http://postedat.wordpress.com/2012/03/05/spirtual-abuse-by-the-so-called-christian-leaders/
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Follow the Money trail”, ONE OF THE OLDEST RULES OF NEWS JOURNALISM AS WELL https://postedat.wordpress.com/2012/03/13/about-those-hirelings-now-fleecing-the-sheep/
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Unfortunately in decades I have only encountered a handful of good pastors of the MANY, many that I have met. Most were pretenders, imposters, hirelings. A past pastor called me into his office and told me bluntly, face to face that he was upset that he could not exert control over me and my brother, because we were too close to eachother. Now my first rightful reaction was what kind of demon was he the Pastor that he wanted to have any control over me in the first place. Such too often selfish, self centered, control freaks as we know are now even mentally sick persons.. but this bad founding church pastor next lost pastorship rightfully of the church he had help to start now as well. He was mongst many other bad pastors I next also had encountered. http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/07/07/control-freaks/
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>>“Do you know of any churches where the elders willingly present themselves before the church on a regular basis”
yes I have met good functioning elders and bad ones as well..
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/09/15/too-often-misleading-preachers/
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/09/13/a-hireling-in-an-evangelical-church/
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/08/31/get-real-now/
https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/08/13/pastors-elders-shepherds-christian-leaders-evangelists/
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/11/27/posted-2/
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/the-false-jesus-name-apostolic-holiness-church-oneness-pentecostal-christianity/
http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/01/21/god-speaks/
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As to “in love submit one to another”…
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According to my reading of the scriptures the term Pastor is always plural, not singular, meaning there are now to be many pastors in any local church, and pastors also equally, mutally thus they do have to submit to the other also called, gifted elders, who are the apostles- missionaries and prophets- all appointed by God as his spokesman – the NT Greek verb is continually present- meaning God now continues to give these men ( or women – such as Junia note worthy amongst the apostles) unto the church now as well , but today most evangelical pastors tend to deny the existence of these other God ordained, given offces even today, Bas pastors do this even firstly because they themselves are rebels, those persons who wrongfully refuse to submit to any other’s and always submission is mutal- meaning reciprocal.. and also do note this it is still voluntarily, unenforceable.. Dictatorial pastors, control freak pastors tend to be ungoldy persons still and we do not have to follow after them at all. Yes they still exist too often in too many local churches.
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(Gal 5:19 KJV) Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
(Deu 31:27 KJV) For I know thy rebellion, and thy stiff neck: behold, while I am yet alive with you this day, ye have been rebellious against the LORD; and how much more after my death?
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I heard firsthand one teenager saying to another teenager , “I cannot trust you, you lie to me all the time” and this next had made me reflect upon the reality that the average person lies 3 times in every ten minutes of conversation, and it also reminded me with my past years of undeniable dealing with Bell related to my internet download problems, they too had lied to me all the time, by not admitting the truth first that there was a problem, nor next honestly admitting the cause of the problem. It seems that spin doctoring, misleading, lying to others is a very major part of not just the lawyers, used car salesmen, but a regular part of the sales, advertising, corporate way of doing business with consumers these days Canada wide now as well. http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2009/05/21/why-many-businesses-fail/
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It seems also that lying, cheating, stealing, adultery, pornography, alcoholism, slander, gossiping, etc., is something that too many pastors also cannot give up on these days too. http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/09/13/a-hireling-in-an-evangelical-church/
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Now it was interesting I had met this really crooked head elder and head deacon in a Baptist church, not just in the Pentecostal churches, where there too their elders and deacons, tend to be pretentious ones ( for when was the last time you saw an elder giving food, money to the poor persons in the church as was done in the book of Acts?) .. even such as the one who was an elder and owned a bar that served alcohol of all things, and who borrowed money from others in the church for his business and then refused to pay it back too, he also next ran to be a local politicans but lost now.. .. and told me if I come to his church he would call the police against me, but the same bad church I next rather had helped to close down permanently , for I had the federal government remove their tax exempt license after I had exposed in writing to news editors, elected officials too their much too many unacceptable abuses, money thefts, slanders, etc.,
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Now a Baptist pastor had cheated, for he had short circuited the elders, deacons church selection process, he had the nominating committee first, before any selection submit the names to him for his prior approval of their supposedly spiritual qualifications and he thus by thes emans had elected his bad friends.. one Sunday evening as I was leaving the church and shaking hands with the pastor, he unexpectedly said to me ” this is my church and if you do not like it get out”.. shocked and surprised I said to the pastor if I have offended you let me meet you now this week Tuesday night and you can bring any two witnesses you want as well and we can discuss the matter. So he agreed and I knew that he would bring the head elder and the head deacons.. as I walked into the pastor’s office on Tuesday day night, the founding church pastor said immediately to me wipe the smirk of your face.. so I immediately said.. hey pastor let us also now make this quick, “Did you or did you not say to me this is my church and if you do not like it get out?” And you should have seen the shock on the deacon and elder’s faces. The pastor seeing this too next said you cannot hear any charges from this man for I am a senior and if you listen to him I will resign. I said “Pastor if you want to resign, do so, but cut of the emotional black main and answer the question”.. he resigned instead, and became a life insurance salesman rather next..
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But now I still had a problem with the crooked head elder of South Calgary Community Church so I tried to first talk to him about his immoral acts and lack of spirituality, he admitted to me that he had no time to read the Bible even.. but it was useless to talk to him for he laughed me off. So next the elder came to see me and said “you know when you told everyone about my lack of spirituality it did not bother me, it was your word against mine, but when you next had put it in writing to all to see it hurt”.. and I said back to him.. “is that what it takes to cause you to rightfully repent?” seems people tend to believe the truth only if it is in wring these days.. and ever since that day I have also next been posting unacceptable, unrepented of sins of many, many a bad pastors and elder on the net but few of them next repented, less than 5 percent next, some of them even moved rather out of town instead.. and many were rightfully fired next. The next few churches I went to now were not any better..
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(Gal 6:1 KJV) Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
(Gal 6:2 KJV) Bear ye one another’s burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.
(Gal 6:3 KJV) For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.
(Gal 6:4 KJV) But let every man prove his own work, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
(Gal 6:5 KJV) For every man shall bear his own burden.
(Gal 6:7 KJV) Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
(Gal 6:8 KJV) For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
(Gal 6:9 KJV) And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
(Gal 6:10 KJV) As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.
(Lev 19:17 KJV) Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
(Psa 104:7 KJV) At thy rebuke they fled; at the voice of thy thunder they hasted away.
(Prov 9:8 KJV) Reprove not a scorner, lest he hate thee: rebuke a wise man, and he will love thee.
(Prov 13:1 KJV) A wise son heareth his father’s instruction: but a scorner heareth not rebuke.
(Prov 24:25 KJV) But to them that rebuke him shall be delight, and a good blessing shall come upon them.
(Prov 27:5 KJV) Open rebuke is better than secret love.
(Eccl 7:5 KJV) It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise, than for a man to hear the song of fools.
(Isa 66:15 KJV) For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.
(Jer 15:15 KJV) O LORD, thou knowest: remember me, and visit me, and revenge me of my persecutors; take me not away in thy longsuffering: know that for thy sake I have suffered rebuke.
(Luke 17:3 KJV) Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
(Phil 2:15 KJV) That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
(1 Tim 5:1 KJV) Rebuke not an elder, but entreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;
(1 Tim 5:20 KJV) Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
(2 Tim 4:2 KJV) Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
(Titus 1:13 KJV) This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
(Titus 2:15 KJV) These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.
(Rev 3:19 KJV) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
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Now can a bad pastor rightfully fire a good or bad deacon, meaning often a non functioning , pretentious elder?
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Bad people try to do many things.. if others let them do it as well.. PRAY FOR THEM, TALK TO THEM AND ASK THEM TO REPENT.. GOD WILL DO THE REST..
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Bad pastors, bad elders continue to exist cause likely the congregation is bad too. (Jer 5:31 KJV) The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?
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I have yet to see a Bible verse saying the local church is solely to be run by one man, one pastor, a dictator now too.. for that matter! and not the elders of that Church..
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We all do even need to seriously know, differentiate between how God now deals with the wicked, those persons deliberately disobedient to him, he God does not go along with them for sure .. God’s grace of forgiveness even does not extend to everyone..
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and next the righteous those people who put their trust in him.. God is merciful, kind to them, but not all professing Christians now are righteous for sure as well.
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Here also is what I know for sure in Canada proper policing, management , supervision human rights commissions are a real fact of life, society, in schools, life, in churches, governments, commerce, institutions, civil and public services, professional services too, and elsewhere, even on the net, for you will always have those 30 percent at least of the persons who will try to cheat, lie , steal, bend the rules, falsely believe they are above the laws, Self regulation alone is too often pretentious, farcical, often not applied as well. That applies especially to the professionals, civil and public services, police, municipalities, politicians now as well..
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I was really, really surprised as to how many persons lie, are being lied to in life, in churches..
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(Josh 22:22 KJV) The LORD God of gods, the LORD God of gods, he knoweth, and Israel he shall know; if it be in rebellion, or if in transgression against the LORD, (save us not this day,)
(1 Sam 15:23 KJV) For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.
(Prov 17:11 KJV) An evil man seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him.
(Jer 28:16 KJV) Therefore thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will cast thee from off the face of the earth: this year thou shalt die, because thou hast taught rebellion against the LORD.
(Jer 29:32 KJV) Therefore thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will punish Shemaiah the Nehelamite, and his seed: he shall not have a man to dwell among this people; neither shall he behold the good that I will do for my people, saith the LORD; because he hath taught rebellion against the LORD.
(Jer 6:27 KJV) I have set thee for a tower and a fortress among my people, that thou mayest know and try their way. 28 They are all grievous revolters, walking with slanders: they are brass and iron; they are all corrupters. 29 The bellows are burned, the lead is consumed of the fire; the founder melteth in vain: for the wicked are not plucked away. 30 Reprobate silver shall men call them, because the LORD hath rejected them.
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Always a good idea to pray for the church..
Elders running a church and not a pastor is the New testament Norm..
see
All of these sites have great devotional, inspirational, Biblical readings, and pictures as well
pass them on..
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* Some of the wrong reasons some men and women become pastors are a desire for fame, public recognition, a safe career, prestige, a domination or controlling attitude.. pride..
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The New Testament Church Structure, Which one is Biblical, the right one for tofday? Does God firstly really lead the Church even today by an one man or an eldership form of structure – an one directional pyramidal structure, or even the totally reverse also, a Congregationalist one? or the bi directional pyramidal structure or what? Do you even really know what the New Testament says now on this?
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Firstly Christ is the sole head of the Church, even today.
It sadly seems that even in the Church today something have wrongfully not changed.. pastors, elders, deacons are fighting for positions, recognition, and seem to have forgotten the flock..
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Some Christians today interpret Romans 11:26 as applying to the end of the seven-year tribulation when Jesus appears in the clouds at His Second Coming. In other words, they don’t apply the verse to all Jews throughout history, but only to “all Jews” who are alive at the end. Supposedly, at the end of the tribulation, all remaining Jews in Israel will look up, see Christ coming in the clouds, realize He is the true Messiah, believe in Him, and thus “All Israel will be saved.”This is a false teaching, Rather the immediate context of Romans 11:26 is vs. 25. When “the fullness of the Gentiles has come in,” then “all Israel will be saved.” Or, to be exact, “And so all Israel will be saved.” In other words, the coming in of the fullness or total number of the Gentiles results in “all Israel” …being saved. Paul’s idea seems to be that when all Gentiles (totally, throughout history) have come in, that is, have been grafted into the Vine, they, uniting with all Jews who have become believers, will form the total number of the saved.The Israel of God is composed of both Jews and Gentiles who believe in Jesus Christ (Gal. 3:29). The “all Israel that is saved” does not apply to all Jews throughout history, nor can it apply to a select favored group who become instant believers when Jesus Christ comes crashing down through the sky. By that time, it is too late to believe. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2008/07/24/jews-and-their-own-need-of-salvation-by-jesus-christ-still-too/
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Now we all do really have freedom of religion, freedom of choice, freedom of speech, the right to be heard now as well.. I clearly do believe in the right of everyone to speak, to speak out as well, and to be equally heard by all, so we can all judge what has been said if it is appropriate and we can next corresponding act upon it, even in the church, in the government, on the internet now too. Clearly some bad people falsely still DO DISALLOW THIS RIGHT… the realy bad persons especially as even I know this for sure as they falsely refuse the whole to be shared even as as to who they are firstly. They respond with a personal attack, inquisition, censorship, lies, slanders, diversions, distortions, instead of facing, dealing with the facts, truths being presented. Confirming to many what they still are really like, immoral, abusive bullies. http://witnessed.wordpress.com/2012/04/11/now-about-the-abusers-bullies-thugs-proud-oppressors-war-mongers/
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Missing the point? 
It has always confounded me as to why the crooks, abusers too often do still do think they can get away with now, next and forever.
FOR WE TEND TO KNOW THAT THEY THE CROOKS, ABUSERS TOO, NOW ARE NOT ABOUT TO STOP THEIR WRONG DOINGS. RATHER THEY WILL NEXT EVEN ESCALATE, CONTINUE IN THEM. AND THAT IS ANOTHER VALID REASON THEY DO NEED TO BE EXPOSED, PROSECUTED AND STOPPED. EVEN FOR THE GOOD OF US ALL.
Comment by thenonconformer — August 7, 2008 @ 9:00 pm
[…] My own witness alone posted above even is an undeniable fact . Now stop falsely working for the devil and TELLING ME to whom AND WHAT I AM allowed to write AND WHAT I CAN AND CANNOT DO.. DO TRY TO CONTROL yourself firstly SOLEY . see also http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/14/changing-yourself-first-positively/ http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/verbal-abuse-is-always-unacceptable-too/ http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/07/17/the-too-common-abusive-silent-treatment/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/18/libel-2/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/06/27/libel/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/07/control-freaks/ http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/06/15/bullies-free-speech/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/21/the-pretender-imposter-wolf-in-sheep-clothing/ http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2008/07/21/hidden-agendas/ http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/06/23/another-bully/ https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/ […]
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Pingback by Friendly, Friends, Soulmate, Friendship, Companion « Focus on the Family — August 9, 2008 @ 2:26 am
It has been very interesting to me that some of the biggest alcoholics and false proponents of ALCOHOL now are Ministers themselves.. and what else do they do? tax evasions, adultery, divorce, slander, gossip, no wonder in my own real personal experiences the last 5 decades too that 70 percent of the pastors are ungodly, immoral still and undeniably very very few people respect them anymore for what they do and say.
It is often also non surprising to me that people who are closed to be led by the Holy spirit, to Pentecostalism, tongues would prefer the demonic spirit of drunkenness.
No other issue tends to divide the church and evoke as much deep seated emotion as the question of alcohol, but only for the alcoholics now too, for in general, is itself a false statement.. for clearly the issue of gay marriages, but note esepcially speaking in tongues, Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and Healing, gifts of the Holy spirit, impartation, cause more discussions and oppositions too, as the Anglican Church splits, and as the latests net exposes about the Todd Bentley Florida revival has clearly shown
Comment by thenonconformer — October 23, 2008 @ 1:19 am
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Pingback by The really Bad churches.. « Missing the point? — September 16, 2009 @ 9:31 am
[…] (Luke 6:43 KJV) For a good tree bringeth not forth corrupt fruit; neither doth a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 44 For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes. 45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh. https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/ […]
Pingback by Posted « Posted at wordpress.com — November 28, 2009 @ 6:42 am
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Pingback by My Top Christian Posts of mine « Posted at wordpress.com — November 30, 2009 @ 4:48 am
[…] deacons bad elders bad-church Filed under: Uncategorized — thenonconformer @ 7:41 am https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/ Leave a […]
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Pingback by Top Christian Posts of mine « JESUS SAYS COME — February 15, 2010 @ 8:34 am
Our church had a food pantry that many came to. One of the elders who is said to be the boss of the church by which this was said of him by the new pastor who was at the time interim, chose to shut the pantry down. We have no children in our church other than the few this elder approves of. Every Sunday, we have a group that he has come and sing 3 songs that one of them tries to sing like Elvis and it is always on the lines of a performance. I have never been to a church where an elder has more authority than the pastor as I thought the elders and deacons minister to the body. Most of the people that went to my church left because of this deacon. I know many think I am judging this man but I have seen what is happening and now our church has 20 members. Is it wrong to pray this man is removed from this body? ( or is the whole church dead, pray it revives)
Comment by Mary — July 25, 2010 @ 4:17 am
Always a good idea to pray for the church..
Elders running a church and not a pastor is the New testament Norm..
The New Testament Church Structure, Which one is Biblical, the right one for tofday? Does God firstly really lead the Church even today by an one man or an eldership form of structure – an one directional pyramidal structure, or even the totally reverse also, a Congregationalist one? or the bi directional pyramidal structure or what? Do you even really know what the New Testament says now on this?
Firstly Christ is the sole head of the Church, even today.
It sadly seems that even in the Church today something have wrongfully not changed.. pastors, elders, deacons are fighting for positions, recognition, and seem to have forgotten the flock..
see
http://pbulow.tripod.com/struct.html
http://pbulow.tripod.com/shepherd.html
http://pbulow.tripod.com/pastors.html
http://pbulow.tripod.com/ministry.htm
http://pbulow.tripod.com/
Comment by thenonconformer — July 25, 2010 @ 10:40 pm
enjoy it very much please send me up dates.
Comment by maria perez — August 2, 2010 @ 2:52 am
Please read http://www.dictatorpastors.com
Very interesting material/reading
Comment by Anonymous — September 11, 2010 @ 5:47 pm
It is interesting that one of the clear signs of a bad pastor is a false, controlling spirit that tries to control others.. besides their Cleary lack of and a false justifications for the lack of the fruit of the holy spirit.. evidently too no love for the sheep, not even their own.
Now the existence of bad persons and also bad pastors is nothing new in north America, 70 percent of the pastors are bad in all denominations , and it has to do with their selection process. They have not been chosen by God firstly to be pastors.
One of the best way that I have discovered to get to know what a pastor is really like, is work with him in the ministry just for one whole day,.. and I was shocked what I saw next.. lying, bullying, control freak..
Read more on this
Questions to ask a Candidating Pastor
How to Tell if a Pastor is Deceitfull
Cult Leaders Links
The Coming Destruction of the Baptist Churches
Modern Fundamentalism
Pulpit Bullying a true Story
Excuses False Pastors Make
This happened to me anonymous
Things that make bad authority
A Controlling Pastor Another True Story
Jack Hyles Links and Videos You be the Judge
Cult and Dictator Pastors What Has Gone Wrong
Profile of a cult leader
List of people that should never pastor a church
Qualifications of a Pastor
deception-of-false-pastors
Preacher Rule According to the Scriptures
fundamentalism-and-the-Klan
What is a Cult Leader
Letters of Pastor Abuse
The IFB Movement of the late 1800s a Hoax
Modern Fundamentalism is Just Re-wrapped Liberal
Dysfunctional Churches
Are You a Controlling Person
Independent Baptist Glossary
Letter to Church by pastor Who Was Candidating
20 Reasons Fundemental Churches are Falling Apart
How To Spot an Abusive Church
What About Soul Winning
Did Modern Fundamentalism Leave out Fundamentals
Exposing False Pastors Blog
Videos on Cult Leaders a Must Watch
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Comment by Ocean City — September 12, 2010 @ 12:34 pm
The hireling preacher
One of the worst things you can do is to think that such a person, spouse, relative, family member, pastor, politician is a nice guy, OR ANY INSTITUTION, CHURCH NOW AS WELL and so it is worth being worshipped, praised.. well cause very shortly God will show you really what even the person now is really like, a sinner like all the rest of us.. and the political party, organization, church you worshipped.. If you also do try to maintain you are a good person now as well, God will not let that false pride stand before him as well and he will show to you and many others what you really are still are like.. For God is a jealous God and will have no false idols NOW before him.. God says without me you can do nothing, nothing good that will last permanently, that the canker worms will next not destroy as well.. I have seen so many good guys in my life, some have been my close good friends, but real life next showed to us all what they really were like next too.. sinners.
I do not really worry about what is happening in the world, but rather mainly what is happening in the Churches, for judgment begins in the house of God. God is still coming for a church without spot and blemish
Wrongful inactions, Cover ups, False denial of bad politicians, bad cops, bad persons, false pastors, false priests are much too common but nevertheless they do get exposed, revealed to all as to what they are often now like too, and get what they deserve, and not the first or last time. (Hosea 10:2 KJV) Their heart is divided; now shall they be found faulty: he shall break down their altars, he shall spoil their images. (Prov 27:5 KJV) Open rebuke is better than secret love. (Rev 3:19 KJV) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
Public exposure and prosecution of the guilty still serves as a rightful deterrent example to all and is still one of the best approaches on how to deal with the evil persons. Even the Bible records openly the unrepentant sins of many persons and their real negative consequences. Too many of the preachers are unacceptably also guilty of preaching “Do what I say and not what I do still too”.
False distractions, false detours, perversions, useless and futile alternatives next now are a too common fact of life, but we need to be personally rooted, grounded in a direct fellowship with God, his Word daily and in his Love , in Jesus, instead. When a person is young he or she, they are often now lead to believe that a whole world lies beyond them, a world of positive future, great potential and a great future, but that is only until God reveals the reality of all sinful men, that man is always sinful and there basically is nothing good in them. Job himself had such a direct revelation from God.
(Job 3:1 KJV) After this opened Job his mouth, and cursed his day. 2 And Job spake, and said, 3 Let the day perish wherein I was born, and the night in which it was said, There is a man child conceived. 4 Let that day be darkness; let not God regard it from above, neither let the light shine upon it. 5 Let darkness and the shadow of death stain it; let a cloud dwell upon it; let the blackness of the day terrify it. 6 As for that night, let darkness seize upon it; let it not be joined unto the days of the year, let it not come into the number of the months.
We all do even need to seriously know, differentiate between how God now deals with the wicked, those persons deliberately disobedient to him, he God does not go along with them for sure .. God’s conditional grace of forgiveness even does not extend to everyone..
Apostle Paul himself saw himself as the chief of sinners.. (1 Tim 1:15 KJV) This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
Jesus also saw all men still as sinners.. (Luke 5:32 KJV) I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
I still today, these days do encounter RATHER NAIVE people who refuse to admit, to see, hear any negatives, especially ANY NEGATIVE REALITIES, the want and accept no criticism, even the same persons who only only want to encounter, hear only about the positives, such as good news.. or the gospel of prosperity… and some preachers wrongfully only feed them such food, babies’ milk..
The grace of God is not a cheap, free licence that will remove the negative personal consequence of any unrepentant, deliberate sins still.. I have really also learned form observing many persons the last many decades that there tends to be no such thing as a little bit pregnant, that to open the barn door even a little bit, and next left unrestrained, undisciplined, unsupervised, realy still means the barn door next it will eventually swing wide open.. and when any person tends to personally allow, start a little acceptable vice, eventually the other even bigger vices do now also tend to grow, develop there as well.. and they too all thus next can be easily discovered, even though the guilty persons will deny this.. even now next the vices of pre-marital sex, sodomy, polygamy, alcoholism, gambling, adultery, drunkenness, bingeing, gluttony, gouging, Self-destructive behaviors, selfishness, indifference, apathy, jealousy, anger, hate, envy, rudeness, irritability or grudges , lust, cussing, cheating , addiction, shoplifting, stealing, tax evasions and even abusive behaviors, pride, lying.
(1 Cor 6:9 KJV) Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
(Mat 7:3 KJV) And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.
Personal Vices unrestrained are not only self-destructive but next also harmful to many others. They are not only limited solely as a result to one’s actions, but rather tend comprises of what is initially inside a person’s heart. (1 Cor 11:31 KJV) For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
Many a Christian even have also a false doctrine towards their sins, false reasons not to not to repent, they call it falsely the dispensation of, the age of grace, and they still lie when they say God will merely next forgive all of their unrepentant sins or deliberate ones. God is not mocked for what one sows will they reap..
The unrepentant sins of any person, nation still even today has next God’s negative corrections.. for God is not to be scoffed at. Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.
and next the righteous those people who put their trust in him.. God is merciful, kind to them, but not all professing Christians now are righteous for sure as well.
Bad people try to do many things.. if others let them do it as well..
Bad pastors, bad elders continue to exist cause likely the congregation is bad too. (Jer 5:31 KJV) The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof?
Let another man praise thee and not thyself.. and check if what is said is really so now too.. and all this now is nothing new as well. How many of you do know that even the preacher now can lie too?
(Acts 20:31 KJV) Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears. 32 And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified. 33 I have coveted no man’s silver, or gold, or apparel. 34 Yea, ye yourselves know, that these hands have ministered unto my necessities, and to them that were with me. 35 I have showed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.
(Acts 17:11 KJV) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
The preacher himself now, dressed in a nice looking suit too, appeared to be sincere, honest, he claimed even to be a good pastor that cared, and claimed to be a good preacher as well.. well it is one thing to make a claim..
Like even most of you I too have eaten a lot of meals, I have been to good and bad restaurants and I too know some meals are great, whereas others are mediocre, and some can even make you sick if they now have been poorly prepared, even with bad ingredients. So I rightfully pick and choose where I eat now and what as well. I have been to a lot of evangelical churches too, the good and bad ones, and heard many a bad pastor now too. I do not rightfully recommend the bad pastors, the bad churches.
One thing I do hate about too many preachers’ still is that I do have to now even separate the wheat from the tares, to separate the meat from the bones, because it seems too many of the preachers still get demonically distracted from staying on the subject of worshipping God, and wrongfully tend to exalt themselves, to criticize the others too, and throw in the devils lies with their sermons still too. This same preacher that I now was listening too as well who now instead of sticking with the word of God itself, the preacher clearly to waste his time next digresses and even misleads now often too. He next rather tired us out with his useless talks also about politics, pollution, entertainment, his home, his cell phone, his car, his garden now as well.. and he was unable to stay on the Bible, to clearly present the essential truths..He explained it next all due to the fact that he became tired because of his long preaching.. or rather his poor personal presentation, preperation!
(Psa 109:8 KJV) Let his days be few; and let another take his office.
(Prov 27:2 KJV) Let another man praise thee, and not thine own mouth; a stranger, and not thine own lips.
(Acts 1:20 KJV) For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishopric let another take. (Jer 6:13 KJV) For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely. 14 They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace. 15 Were they ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at all ashamed, neither could they blush: therefore they shall fall among them that fall: at the time that I visit them they shall be cast down, saith the LORD. 16 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein. 17 Also I set watchmen over you, saying, Hearken to the sound of the trumpet. But they said, We will not hearken. 18 Therefore hear, ye nations, and know, O congregation, what is among them. 19 Hear, O earth: behold, I will bring evil upon this people, even the fruit of their thoughts, because they have not hearkened unto my words, nor to my law, but rejected it. 20 To what purpose cometh there to me incense from Sheba, and the sweet cane from a far country? your burnt offerings are not acceptable, nor your sacrifices sweet unto me.
(Jer 7:2 KJV) Stand in the gate of the Lord’s house, and proclaim there this word, and say, Hear the word of the LORD, all ye of Judah, that enter in at these gates to worship the LORD. 3 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, Amend your ways and your doings, and I will cause you to dwell in this place. 4 Trust ye not in lying words, saying, The temple of the LORD, The temple of the LORD, The temple of the LORD, are these. 5 For if ye thoroughly amend your ways and your doings; if ye thoroughly execute judgment between a man and his neighbour; 6 If ye oppress not the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, and shed not innocent blood in this place, neither walk after other gods to your hurt:.. 8 Behold, ye trust in lying words, that cannot profit. 9 Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not; 10 And come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, We are delivered to do all these abominations? 11 Is this house, which is called by my name, become a den of robbers in your eyes? Behold, even I have seen it, saith the LORD. 12 But go ye now unto my place which was in Shiloh, where I set my name at the first, and see what I did to it for the wickedness of my people Israel. 13 And now, because ye have done all these works, saith the LORD, and I spake unto you, rising up early and speaking, but ye heard not; and I called you, but ye answered not; 14 Therefore will I do unto this house, which is called by my name, wherein ye trust, and unto the place which I gave to you and to your fathers, as I have done to Shiloh. 15 And I will cast you out of my sight, as I have cast out all your brethren, even the whole seed of Ephraim. 16 Therefore pray not thou for this people, neither lift up cry nor prayer for them, neither make intercession to me: for I will not hear thee.
False preachers tend not to preach the whole word of God, will of God, rather they tend to be for hire in their preaching and even do preach trying to please their paying masters, they tend to exalt false men, and preach their own values, their own false rules as well.. their own false definitions of what is important, and they abuse others and allow others to be abused who do not give them what they want, do not go along with them and as a result history repeats itself, these bad churches have big splits, even close down.. and the last bad church I was in had 3 big splits even recently.
(1 Pet 5:8 KJV) Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour: 9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world. 10 But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you. 11 To him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
(Jer 6:27 KJV) I have set thee for a tower and a fortress among my people, that thou mayest know and try their way. 28 They are all grievous revolters, walking with slanders: they are brass and iron; they are all corrupters. 29 The bellows are burned, the lead is consumed of the fire; the founder melteth in vain: for the wicked are not plucked away. 30 Reprobate silver shall men call them, because the LORD hath rejected them.
Hey I admit even I too am dumb, slow to learn too sometimes as well..
and it took me a while to next figure out what was wrong with a close, personal friend of mine, an evangelical pastor, and also with his associates now too in one of our local churches now too.. for he often had some of the right sounding words.. but some how I knew something was always obviously basically wrong.. it even was the fact he clearly was always now concerned about the Basics of life: food, clothing, shelter, job, image and too often rather.. their concern for having better material things… Hirelings or prostitutes to me it means the same thing.. sadly the last 12 pastors I had personally encountered where now hirelings!
(Mat 6:25 KJV) Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? 26 Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they? 27 Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? 28 And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: 29 And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith? 31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. 33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you. 34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
(Luke 12:22 KJV) And he said unto his disciples, Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat; neither for the body, what ye shall put on.
have often now encountered the hireling in the evangelical churches, you can spot them by their concerns for their housing allowance, filthy lucre, pension fund, and their begging for money ( Hab 2:4 KJV) Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith. (Rom 1:17 KJV) For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. (Heb 10:38 KJV) Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. Do see http://postedat.wordpress.com/2009/08/31/get-real-now/
(Mat 10:8 KJV) Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.
And you will quickly discover there is very little if anything that is freely now given in his church too, on on his websites, but there are plenty of demands, opportunities for you to give your money. This is also typical for many a Word of Faith/Prosperity/Healing ministry and it here too should come as no surprise. Books, tapes and conferences are featured on this website. Opportunities to make an offering or to become a “partner” are also offered.
God punishes still the hirelings in his ministry..
(Job 7:1 KJV) Is there not an appointed time to man upon earth? are not his days also like the days of an hireling?
(Job 7:2 KJV) As a servant earnestly desireth the shadow, and as an hireling looketh for the reward of his work:
(Isa 16:14 KJV) But now the LORD hath spoken, saying, Within three years, as the years of an hireling, and the glory of Moab shall be contemned, with all that great multitude; and the remnant shall be very small and feeble.
(Isa 21:16 KJV) For thus hath the Lord said unto me, Within a year, according to the years of an hireling, and all the glory of Kedar shall fail:
(Mal 3:5 KJV) And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.
(Gen 2:16 KJV) And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
(Ezra 2:68 KJV) And some of the chief of the fathers, when they came to the house of the LORD which is at Jerusalem, offered freely for the house of God to set it up in his place:
(Ezra 7:15 KJV) And to carry the silver and gold, which the king and his counsellors have freely offered unto the God of Israel, whose habitation is in Jerusalem,
(Psa 54:6 KJV) I will freely sacrifice unto thee: I will praise thy name, O LORD; for it is good.
(Hosea 14:4 KJV) I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him.
(Acts 26:26 KJV) For the king knoweth of these things, before whom also I speak freely: for I am persuaded that none of these things are hidden from him; for this thing was not done in a corner.
(Rom 3:24 KJV) Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
(Rom 8:32 KJV) He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
(1 Cor 2:12 KJV) Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
(2 Cor 11:7 KJV) Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely?
(Rev 21:6 KJV) And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
(Rev 22:17 KJV) And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
(2 Tim 4:10 KJV) For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; .
(John 10:12 KJV) But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.
(John 10:13 KJV) The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.
When Good Preachers Make Bad Pastors: Bringing Balance to Pastoral Ministry
Jim Pile Associate Pastor, Pastoral Care Grace Community Church
While preaching is an indispensable part of our role as pastors in shepherding people at a corporate level, shepherding people individually is just as vital in our work for the kingdom.
. Before we look at principles for shepherding others, we, as pastors can fail in ministry if we don’t keep building on the right “foundation.” What is that foundation? It’s the Word of God as it relates to our own lives. Before we can lead with excellence, we must walk in a manner worthy of our calling.
. Personal holiness is a foundational requirement for true and powerful spiritual leadership.
– 1 Peter 1:15-16 “But like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior; because it is written, ‘You shall be holy, for I am holy.’”
– “A minister may fill his pews, his communion roll, the mouths of the public, but what that minister is on his knees in secret before God Almighty, that he is and no more”
(John Owen, cited in I.D.E. Thomas, A Puritan Golden Treasury [Edinburgh: Bannerof Truth, 1977], 192).
. If personal holiness is a key to effective shepherding, then the following are some common temptations that pastors need to be on the alert for:
I. THE SHEPHERD’S TEMPTATIONS
1. Covetousness
– Watch out for coveting someone else’s success in ministry!
– Watch out for praise! People praise your sermons/voice/etc. You want more! This abnormal love of praise is a form of covetousness which is as fatal as the greed for money.
2. Carelessness
– Watch out for putting programs over people. “I’m awfully busy!”
– Don’t say to the invalid – “I’ll go tomorrow!”
– Don’t say to the grieving – My next project is more critical to work on today.
– Don’t say to the wandering sheep – “I’ll go after them later!”
3. Money
– Watch out for desire for money or the lack of it.
– Beware making ministry choices based upon getting more money or else having a smoldering attitude toward the church because you don’t get paid enough. [Titus 1:7 – “not given to filthy lucre” (KJV).]
– Don’t become a “hireling” .lacking a shepherd’s heart.working for pay.eyes ever on his wages.his deepest motive is financial gain. His god is self.
– Paul in Acts 20:33-35 – “I have coveted no one’s silver or gold or clothes. You yourselves know that these hands ministered to my own needs and to the men who were with me. In everything I showed you that by working hard in this manner you must help the weak and remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He Himself said, ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’”
4. Power
– Innate in the souls of men
– Leaders are ambitious men but beware:
o Loving prominence (Diotrephes, 3 John 9-10)
o Craving distinction
o Desiring exalted rank
We need to have the attitude of John the Baptist, “He must increase but I must decrease” (John 3:30).
5. Cynicism
– Beware being hardened by ministry frustrations over people who don’t change.
“God’s people who treat you worse than the world.”
– Beware when no testimony thrills you anymore, no sermon moves you, no bookmotivates you, or you haven’t read one for quite some time.
6. Success/ Business
– Watch out when your church grows.more meetings, less devotions
– Don’t become CEOs; don’t become managers instead of ministers
– Beware more pragmatism than doctrine, more style than substance, more denominational politics than doctrine.
7. Sexual sin
– Beware sexual sin! It consumes ministers at an alarming rate!
– Statistics on Pastors/ Sexual Sin
. A survey conducted by Christianity Today of its readership in August 2000 revealed that 33% of clergy have visited a sexually explicit Internet site at least once within the past year, of which 53% have done so “a few times.” The survey also revealed that 18% had visited pornographic sites between “a couple of times a month” and “more than once a week” (Christianity Today, March 5, 2001, 44-45).
. 75% of pastors do not make themselves accountable to anyone for their Internet use. (”Leadership” Magazine, “Pastors and Internet Pornography,”
Winter 2001. 2000 Survey, 564 respondents)
. High number of pay-for-view pornographic videos at hotels hosting conferences for pastors. Remove the T.V.
8. Pride (God and people hate this sin the most.)
– Don’t ever think too highly of yourself and your gifts.
– James 4:6 “But He gives a greater grace. Therefore it says, “GOD IS OPPOSED TO THE PROUD, BUT GIVES GRACE TO THE HUMBLE.”
– The greater the influence God gives a pastor, the greater he becomes in his own sight.
– “My ministry,” not God’s!
– Some new or strange doctrine that is not biblical.
“At every stage of our Christian development and in every sphere of our Christian discipleship, pride is our greatest enemy and humility our greatest friend” (John Stott, in Alive to God, p. 119).
. You know of ministers who have fallen or given in to some of these temptations. Within 5 years, ½ of seminary graduates drop out of ministry. Only 1 in 20 remain at 65 years old!
Some of you here today are struggling with some of these temptations. And if you are thinking “I’ll never fall to any of these temptations,” then you haven’t been in ministry for very long.
. Pastoral Epistles – In Paul’s instructions to Titus and Timothy, he mentions thirteen times that ministries were ruined by some of these temptations.
– In 1 Timothy
1:6 there were ministers who had “turned aside to fruitless discussion.”
1:19 some had “suffered shipwreck in regard to their faith.”
4:2 he warned of ministers filled with “the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron.”
6:4 he told Timothy to watch out for the minister who “is conceited and understands nothing; but he has a morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words, out of which arise envy, strife, abusive language, evil suspicions.”
6:5 Paul spoke of the hold money had on some ministers, for he says, they “suppose that godliness is a means of gain.”
6:20-21 he warned Timothy to avoid ministers characterized by “worldly and empty chatter and the opposing arguments of what is falsely called ‘knowledge’ – which some have professed and thus gone astray from the faith.”
– In 2 Timothy 1:15 Paul names two ministers (Phygelus & Hermogenes) who “turned away from me.”
2:16-18 he speaks of ministers whose “talk will spread like gangrene.” Then he names two such ministers (Hymenaeus & Philetus) “who have gone astray from the
truth.”
3:5 he warns of ministers who are “holding to a form of godliness, although theyhave denied its power.”
3:8 these ministers are “men who oppose the truth.”
4:3-4 Paul speaks of ministers who will teach in accordance to the desires of people who “will not endure sound doctrine,” and will “tickle the ears” with myths instead of truth.
– In Titus 1:10-11 he described many ministers as “rebellious men, empty talkers and deceivers,
. teaching things they should not teach for the sake of sordid gain.”
1:16 he warned of ministers who “profess to know God, but by their deeds they deny Him, being detestable and disobedient and worthless for any good deed.”
continued http://audio.gracechurch.org/sc/2005notes/PileWhenGoodPreachersMakeBadPastors.pdf
Do what I say over do what I do is part of the hypocrisy now existing too often too at all levels, federal, provincial, municipal and not just in many preacher’s lives now as well..
If you are a Control freak you are not only still an unrealistic, immature, immoral person but you may have a serious personality disorder. http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/07/control-freaks/ http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/08/12/more-about-control-freaks/
I too do not have to accept any Church corruptions by any pastors now in Canada as well.
(1 Cor 5:11 KJV) But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
(Mat 24:48 KJV) But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
I have to admit it came to me as a shock firstly when I started to attend evangelical, Baptist, Pentecostal churches in Canada now as an adult that that same right to be respect, to speak, and to be heard, not to be bullied, falsely oppressed, the Legal and Human rights that I had before, often now did not exist in the churches surprisingly now of all places. Never saw so many control freaks, human rights abusers in my whole life next to the too often bad cops now too. And perversely many a despotic, crooked elder, pastor had wrongfully tried to shut me up, and even next had resorted next to slander me, to try to discredit me and what I had said, or whatever, now even both in Quebec and in Alberta.
The last thing on my mind when I go to a new evangelical Christian church is that I will be abused, lied to, slandered, robbed, misused, persecuted but sadly now too often these days that is not the reality. Why?
(1 Cor 2:2 KJV) For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified. (Gal 6:14 KJV) But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
The far right itself often still coerces others who do not go along with them by “Borking” them. ”Taiwanizing” means calumniating, ostracizing, excluding and hopefully ultimately de-legitimizing a country. Doing the same thing to a person is called “Borking”. Borking is “to attack a person’s reputation and views unfairly,” includes the concerted attack on the challenger’s character, background and philosophy.. Example to fire an honest government official in an attempt to prevent embarrassment to and exposure of a dishonest government officeholder who has conspired to commit high crimes, the 1973 unacceptable firing, massacre of Watergate Special Prosecutor Archibald Cox by Solicitor General Robert Bork, orchestrated by both Bork and President Richard Nixon . Conservative activists have been making the same action over and over again in regard to the so called liberals, leftists, news media reporters: The borked opponents aren’t debated but merely shut down, censored, their free speech denied, and often next immediately they are forcibly removed, kicked out, never allowed to be discussed again too by anyone, and hopefully insuring their person and his views being totally excluded from the rest of the local group, community. The fact this is too often practiced in too many evangelical churches of all places is astounding. The real Irony and hypocrisy is the right wing often claim they rather now are being Borked even while they are Borking the others.
As a professional, University graduate I now was always solely responsible for my work output, no one told me how to do it too, I had always worked on my own with minimum supervision. I step into a church, in many or most churches I am treated as if I am now in pre school generally, I am immediately given a whole bunch of rules, even as to where I can sit, what I can wear, how much money I should give to the church, what I can do and cannot do etc.. mostly a totally demonic, controlling, dominating environment, so much so that I rightfully often think that the Holy Spirit, Jesus Christ themselves are not allowed to express themselves, not given freedom to manifest themselves too. If I dare to openly question anything I am threatened with police action and immediate church dismissal too. Forget about being showed mutual respect in this caged circus rather. This is all just perversity and not freedom in Christ. Thank God that not all churches now are like this.
(Gal 3:26 KJV) For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
(Job 13:4 KJV) But ye are forgers of lies, ye are all physicians of no value.
(1 Cor 14:29 KJV) Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
(1 Cor 14:31 KJV) For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.
Colossians 3:21 “Fathers, provoke not your children [to anger], lest they be discouraged.” Matthew 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.
The Bible itself cleary posts the name of many of those now who had sinned, and did not repent, and some of their negative consequences too, as a warning to all the others who would equally be now next tempted to sin and not repent . Bad shepherds, priests, ungentle control freaks included who had allowed the flock to be abused.
I USED TO BE NAÏVE ONCE AS TO WHAT GOES ON IN CHURCHES AND WHAT PASTORS CAN BE REALLY LIKE NOW TOO. ALSO WHAT POLITICS, JUDGES, LAWYERS, COPS, PROFESSIONALS CAN BE LIKE TOO. A BAD PASTOR FIRSTLY TO REPENT NOW NEXT TOO? DON’T too often now EXPECT FOR SURE A MIRACLE HERE OVERNIGHT TOO.
I still would rightfully rather see pastor first live a sermon instead of too often now merely preach it to others and I really do think it is so farcical how some sinfully, proud evangelical pastors are ready to condemn others, to gossip about, to now preach about the other person’s sins but someone how they can’t seem to deal with their own false abuse of others, their own sins, and their own false pride. Sadly I have often been in bad Christian churches where the clearly crooked pastor Stéphane Chauvette Associate Pastor to turn off attention off himself would bash some other churches, some other denominations and some other persons, but all that bashing of his now did not still deny his own sins and his own wrong doings though now. The Bad preacher are not the only ones who can preach about other people’s sins and demand others to repent, so can I, bad pastors now included and I rightfully do often as well. The older I get being falsely persecuted next in the House of God, evangelical churches firstly now, seems to be a norm for me rather than an exception..
Their CONTROLLING BEHAVIOR, their false dominating behavior, is Public Enemy Number One.. If you are a Control freak you are not only still an unrealistic, immature, immoral person but you may have a serious personality disorder. Slave drivers are driven by the devil. http://postedat.wordpress.com/2008/07/07/control-freaks/ http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/08/12/more-about-control-freaks/
While Moses was a great example of meekness it seems many pastors are not these days.. they are anything but meek, they are rather controlling, harsh, unkind, dictatorial, abusive, insulting, unloving,, rather I have often also met in evangelical circles the despotic foremen, dictatorial types, bully, jungle fighter leaders, the same persons who think they are supreme over all others, they can take the law into their own hands, and even do what they want over any others, physically now as well. I have not totally now understood how these unacceptable, abusive slave drivers got to this personality stage or why they falsely think in their abusive pride they will get away with it forever now as well. And yet they mostly lie and deny these sins, falsely claiming rather they are good, loving, kind..
(Gal 6:1 KJV) Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. 2 Bear ye one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. 3 For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceived himself. 4 But let every man prove his own work, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another. 5 For every man shall bear his own burden.
Now as I was also reflecting about my many past posts on the net in the last few years I was really saddened to note that too many of them were about bad , greedy people trying to steal , trying to get other people’s money for themselves, stealing the money, or getting it under false pretences. The love of more money is still the basis of what many of the wrong doings is, was all about..(Eccl 8:11 KJV) Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil
I was also very sad to note as to how many evangelical, Christian pastors, politicians falsely approve of drinking alcohol even though their real Christian colleagues preach against it.. Fundamental evangelical pastors preach it is a sin for any Christian to drink alcohol, Liberal Christians such as Catholics or Eastern Orthodox church say it is not. But one thing no one can deny is how harmful drinking alcohol is.. in Russia 60 percent of men and women die due to drinking alcohol.. how much hurt and damage does alcohol drinking cause in Canada? and how much money does it costs the taxpayers now too? Much too much too.
I have often heard it said that most Canadians Canada wide now are still like fearful sheep they are too ready to be fleeced, sadly it also seems they must have ostrich genes in them for when you present negative truths they tend to often rather bury their heads in the sand as well it seems.. especially in in too many of the evangelical churches.. or the ostrich sheep in Alberta who also now too often seem to think no Conservative politician can ever do any wrong rather it has to be the other bad guys, you know the liberals. Or the BQ separatists, the communist NDP… Ironically the wolves in sheep clothing exist Canada wide, in evangelical churches, political circles too now, and I guess for me telling the truth that is why so many of them hate me, do not hesitate to ban me or kick me out of their often also bad churches now too..
I had attended a recent comical church service, New Beginnings Ministry 9412 Rue Clement Lasalle, QC H8R1T5 Phone: (514) 363-1080., a farcical circus, not the first time now too, where the pastor Stéphane Chauvette Associate Pastor was preaching about everything, bashing everyone else, but somehow he could not keep his own promises, his own word, or stay on a specific valid subject. And he made it clear if you rock his boat he will next also kick you off the ship.. The modern Christian evangelical fundamentalism demands a false blind obedience to a one man minister, ministry and all that he says and falsely bypass the mutually submissiveness eldership rule pattern set forth in the New Testament, book of Acts now as well. This bad fundamental church is no exception to this. FaLSE, CULTISH CHURCH LIKE THIS ONE, LESS THAN A HUNDRED PERSONS NOW TOO, THE 2 PREACHERS THERE THEY LIKE TO JUSTIFY THEIR SMALL NUMBERS BECAUSE THEY PREACH THE TRUTH, THUS THEY ARE A REMNANT, SPECIAL, DISTINCT GROUP OF TRUE BELIEVERS. Would be a lot better if they acted now like true genuine true Christians firstly, and practice real love towards others too. This hypocritical, pretentious fundamental right winged evangelical pastor of this New Life Beginnings in LaSalle, Quebec Preaches next openly now for us not to believe any of the news media and for us not to have anything to do with any person who drinks wine **, and to stand up against all of the people who do any wrong, to even openly speak to them, ( as long as it is not the pastor himself for sure) and yet he lied and says come and talk to me your pastor after church. I am always really interested to hear from you about all of your concerns but in reality when you do try to talk to him.. for next I thus told him that our evangelical Canadian PM Stephen Harper, the supposedly good Christian now drinks beer/wine, well the pastor really got upset at me for this.. since he himself cannot handle negative truths, he the ostrich no good pastor refused to further talk with me and said he was tired now, he refuses to hear any of that, he refuses to believe any of that, for that is all gossip, slanders, and also we do not allow anyone who causes disturbance, problems, gives any criticism in our church, so please leave now. So much for this supposedly Christ like church and their false professing Christian love, false brotherly love, their supposed openness now, and one’s free speech too..
(1 Cor 5:11 KJV) But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
(Mat 24:48 KJV) But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49 And shall begin to smite his fellow servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
** The Pastor had said that God does not let us to talk to anyone who drinks wine, but this is a rather distorted, extreme interpretation of the Bible, The Bible clearly says WE ARE NOT TO FELLOWSHIP WITH A CHRISTIAN PERSON WHO GETS DRUNK.. now that is really different from not talking to any of the people who drink wine.. and why is this pastor so ready not to talk with others now too? so ready to smite them, to kick them out of church? If you have love for someone you are willing to talk with them, but if you do not have love for them, especially if, when you know they do not support you, do not agree with your presentation, do not agree with your point of view, you as a pastor too now can personally can instead refuse to love them, you refuse to talk to them, you find any excuse to reject, ostracize, divorce them basically to deny, to cover up the unacceptable reality that you yourself the pastor actually do not have any love for them.
Our Freedom of speech to many of these despotic, self centered, agenda oriented preacher is generally one way, they alone are allowed to do all of the talking, and no one else, everyone else is only allowed to listen is also what I have directly experienced here too. If you challenge what they say they falsely do immediately divorce you, even physically assault you and kick you out of the church now too. The same pastor says he does not believe anything the news media writes at all. So who does he believe? only himself it seems and anyone else like minded. So what truth is he really now peddling, a distorted ones clearly. For the record, Stephen Harper Prime Minister of Canada himself now did not even deny to me that he drinks beers and/or alcohol, or that he even gives presents of alcohol to others as well. So why do any of the others? Why did this pastor? They can only face the negative reality from a distance… Not the first time I do now meet such fundamental ostriches.. http://thenonconformer.wordpress.com/2009/01/23/alcoholic/
Please do have the local LaSalle police remind the pastors, elders, members, adherents of this Pentecostal church that is is still illegal for the pastor or anyone else now there too to physically assault anyone, even if it is in their church. They may have a right to ask anyone to leave their premises, but as I have witnessed myself now they do not have a right to physically grab, lay hands, assault any person in their church even now too especially when he did nothing wrong.. That right is only for the police and is limited for them as well.. If someone next after being asked refuses to leave the church when asked they can call the police. I told them that I was glad to leave this church on my own free will and will be just as glad not to come back too.
Honor Killings, Violence. In reality too the Cops themselves, RCMP included, now are not the only one who resort to violence when their authority is threatened, so do some clearly bad, hot tempered evangelical pastors now too.. I too before have already experienced in Canada a direct physical assault of me by a rogue Pentecostal pastor who had punched me, physically assaulted me, with no provocation too,, in front of a witness, backed up with a police report , cause I had refused to go to his church. An another Pentecostal pastor and even a church elder, were attempting to physically abuse me to stop my public revelations of his unacceptable acts, thefts of money too. and the same thing had happened to my own brother on another occasion and he too had called the police and reported the matter who also had experience physical assault attempt by a Plymouth Brethren pastor. But none of this should be a surprise when a pastor’s authority, financial security is threatened ehh..
OVER MANY YEARS I HAVE LEARNED THAT PERSONAL, RELIGIOUS CONFLICTS SEEM TO BE UNAVOIDABLE EVEN IN ANY CHRISTIAN CHURCH.. AND WE ALL SHOULD KNOW AS TO HOW SHOULD WE DEAL WITH THEM, REACT TO THEM.. MANY PEOPLE FALSELY RUN AWAY FROM THEM, TRY TO DENY THEY EXISTS.
It is a basic fact the we must all learn to live, communicate in love with one another, and his communication does not mean we have to accept all wrong doing now as well for the devil and his followers will often come to us to try to cause false bondages upon us, to detour us or divert us from the freedoms, truths that we all do we have in Christ. And it is very likely if you or the leader refuses to talk with someone it is really cause you do not love them as well.
http://thenonconformer.yolasite.com/index/hireling
Comment by thenonconformer — September 13, 2010 @ 2:03 am
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good day ,yes I am in agreement that a pastors of god is always visiting the members or non members at any time.Also the pastors of god a always hear the voice of god through his instruction even by reading the word of god ,then most of the pastors of god are filled by the holy spirit, and thus they produce the fruit in Galatians chapter 5 and do read the whole verses, at the same time a good pastor is a man of prayer ,for the bible says without god nothing without the leading of the holy spirit for allof the pastorsthemslves are nothing. so the pastor is alawys preparing the the good presentation of his personality even that the pastors hiself is not stumbling block but he rather is ablessing to the people. So the good pastors will stands alwayson the word of truth, he is doing always what god says and told him what to do , he is staying continously in preaching and in bible studyas well as follow up evangelization house to house and he will not forget to visit his own members to sthrengthen them the time of sorrows , thus he also helps the members when there is persecution he is always alert to oppose the false doctrine, he is always willing to help the needy, and specially the pastor knows that his calling as a pastor is a direct high calling of god in the church.
Comment by alijandre ungue vallescas — February 16, 2011 @ 11:31 pm
That sounds like a proper Biblical role for all Christians, elders and pastors, deacons included now..
Comment by thenonconformer — February 23, 2011 @ 3:46 pm
[…] I strongly support the existence of good church shepherds, good church pastors, good elders, who visit their flock, provide help to them, do keep vigilance, guard over them and their good welfare, visit them in the Hospital too. These acts clearly distinguishes them from the much too many bad pastors, rather pastoral prostitutes or hirelings WE SEEM TO STILL ENCOUNTER EVEN THESE DAYS. * Bad men who were not chosen by God to be shepherds, but rather self appointed even for many wrong reasons. And the term pastors in the Bible is rather a plural one meaning the local church should have many of them now too. Not just a false one man ministry. https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/ […]
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I used to attend this church. We started the construction of the temple shortly after I started to cingregate. I was joyful as I was working for the Lord. About the same time I met this girl at church and I liked her and we became good friends. It was around that time that I realized that my pastor was stealing the water and he was using it for the construction. I became confused and this lasted for like 6 months until I couldnt take it anymore. I confronted him on the issue. When I did hebtold me i was possed. I left, not wanting to be a part of that. Thebpastor proceeded to damage my credentials, he even went as far as talking to the girls dad who is a very dear friend and brother to me. The result is that now i cant talk to her and to be honest, im in love with her. Every one i taugh were my brothers have turned their back on me because i spoke the truth.
Comment by kakarot — August 9, 2012 @ 1:58 am
response to No 42.
That bad pastor and those of its kind will sure face on justment day , these guys are not worth being entitled as pastors , I have seen many of them. Don’t worry God has better plan for those who live by His faith . Some times we get married with not just whom we only love but also with the right person for our life’s sharing. Love alone does not fulfill . God bless. -RB
Comment by Robin Paul — September 17, 2012 @ 2:38 am
very imprtant messages for the sheeples who blindly follow unscriptural teachings…
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How do I report a church elder who has caused major problems in my marriage after pertraying himself to be a marriage counselor and also for extremely inappropriate emails that ere sent to me from him.
Comment by Michelle Williamson — February 19, 2013 @ 12:44 am
To report a bad church elder one the best way to deal with this is to send a latter to all the major newspapers, with a copy to him.. and the Pastor..
Comment by thenonconformer — February 20, 2013 @ 1:23 am
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[…] ARE ALWAYS STILL GOOD AND BAD PASTORS,CHURCHES TOO.. WHERE PEOPLE CAN GET FOOD POISONING TOO.. https://anyonecare.wordpress.com/2008/07/12/bad-pastors-bad-deacons-bad-elders-bad-church/ . Here 28/30 pastor’s relatives were on the church payroll.. and lying, steal, adultery was […]
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Forgive my rants. Just getting things off of my chest. I have had my share of bad pastors, believe me. And the Devil laughs at them because he influences them and they don’t even know it. They don’t know it because they don’t know the Devil like they think they do. Some men are serious pastors for God. Some other men, however, are just along for the ride. They want to only dip one of their thumbs or their big toes in the water and that’s as far as they’re going to go. Some pastors are 9 to 5, Monday to Friday pastors who retire at 65. My advice to them? You’re NOT a pastor, so STOP MOCKING the institution of God and get OUT from the PULPIT. A real pastor is not some 9 to 5, Monday to Friday pastor who retires at 65. Not even close. Truly a pastor’s job is 24/7, 365 days a year – until he’s DEAD.. Period.. That’s a REAL pastor, not these textbook plastic “card board cut outs” that “think” they’re pastors – by their own will and NOT God’s. The Bible says that a pastor will be judged harshly by the Lord if he causes a flock member to stumble and fall. What does this mean? It means that pastors must be above the flock and that there is no excuse for their mistakes. They must be extremely self disciplined. Bible says not to be stumbling blocks. By far one of the worst pastors I have ever experienced was Eugene Braun of Edmonton, Alberta. This man and his wife should leave the ministry all together. His wife Sarah is as transparent as “he” is. Some of us saw right through them. Pastor Braun “thinks” he was “called” by God’s will to “preach”. Sorry. He was NOT “called” by the Lord’s will to “preach”, he was “called” by his “own will”. He is doing God a service without it being his will and he is going to drag that church further and further into the ditch. He took over the job of another pastor (a good pastor for years) who then became corrupted by the Devil and fell back into the world – badly. He continues to be prayed for. Enter Eugene. And enter the saying “from bad to worse”, “from the frying pan into the fire”. This “make believer” takes over and since then has done nothing but flush his church slowly down the toilet. He has turned this church into a country club like most other churches in our neighborhood. Pray that the Lord knock him down and out of the pulpit. He’s as textbook as they come – definitely on my top 10 list of bad pastors. Braun doesn’t know how to run a church.. And some people are seeing that and leaving because they see the light with this counterfeit. He’s rude, snubs his nose at you and is one of those pastors with limited empathy. He only talks to who he likes. Some pastor. A ‘chip off the old Mock’.. Sounds like a 9 to 5’er to me. He talks all the time about “grace”, yet doesn’t know a thing about it. This charlatan was no longer going to get my tithe money. We had enough of his tripe. Braun does NOT have a spirit of discernment on him. At times I don’t even think he has the Holy Spirit on him. He “does” have a spirit though. Some of these “wolves in sheep’s clothing” think they are feeding a flock when really they are actually poisoning it. I pray that the Lord break through that carnal smog in that church and make them see that and knock this man down before it is too late. I wouldn’t listen to this guy’s sermons if he was the last pastor on earth. You know what the Bible says about those who are lukewarm. Basically God spews them from out of his mouth. They are no good to God or man. I would rather listen to a sermon by someone in Atheism (the most idiotic, selfish, disgusting and detestable belief system across the planet). Anybody with half a brain knows that every creation, with all of their intricate details, came from a creator. It didn’t just “magically appear” for no reason from “nothing”. Everybody knows that the only result that can come from nothing is NOTHING. However, my point is, at least an Atheist is COLD from God and NOT lukewarm. Just my opinion or take on that. Now I do know that some of need to learn to forgive the man, this is true. I guess that will take time. I pray for those of you who have been in similar circumstances as some of us. You all have my sympathies. Thank you.
Comment by Former Member — May 16, 2014 @ 8:47 am
70 percent of evangelical pastors are even Ungodly.. God eventually punishes them serious.. many many are fired..
Comment by thenonconformer — May 16, 2014 @ 9:17 am
On the flip side, many of them will NOT get fired either and as a result they will take many of their churches with them to Hell.. Many people are innocent lambs going to a slaughter house.. Not talking about the world outside of the Bible. They’re already there. And whether or not these carnal pastors get fired from the church is in of itself a literal act. They were fired from God a long time ago or were never saved to begin with.. Either or..
Comment by Former Member — May 16, 2014 @ 10:15 am
many of them will NOT get fired either.. is not true.. 70 percent of pastors tend to get fired and often lose their founding churches.. i have see that often myself happening..
Comment by thenonconformer — May 16, 2014 @ 4:50 pm
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Pingback by About those hirelings now fleecing the sheep | 1st Wittness — September 13, 2014 @ 7:31 am
I didn’t attend church but I grew up around church folks. When I was a teenager, I noticed old, black church folks were the meanest people. They cussed, drank, did drugs, and smoked cigarettes. I thought that it was wrong for them to do those thing. Church folks are phony hypocrits.
There’s alot of cheating going on among church goers. My aunt, who recently passed away, had been a member of her church since she was a young girl. You could say she grew up in the church. Once she became an adult, she became involved with only married men. She told me once that she’d always been attracted to men who were already in relationships or married. And she wasn’t ashamed of it either.
One of the pastors of her church has a son who’s a drug dealer. The pastor even helped his son. He’d hide some of his son’s drugs and weapons in the basement of the church and his own home. The authorities overlook staking out churches and pastors’ houses. But they eventually caught up with the son and some time later, the pastor was to have retired. I bet he was kicked out the church.
And I should also mention that church men are having sex with each other. It’s called being on the down low. They are infecting each other and black women in record numbers. Down low dudes are the main reason why such a large % of black women are being infected with HIV. But to find out that pastors, deacons, and bishops are among this group infecting others was a shocker to say the least.
Comment by truth known — September 18, 2014 @ 12:30 pm
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